DO I BUY FROM AND NZKC REGISTERED BREEDER ?
In our opinion it does pay to buy from a New Zealand kennel Club breeder but you still need to be careful and do your homework on any breeder.
A lot of people believe by buying from an NZKC breeder they are dealing with a dedicated and responsible breeder but sadly that is not always the case as anyone can register a kennel with the NZKC but it does not make them knowledgeable on the breed, or a responsible breeder and someone you should purchase a pup from .
So bottom line do your home work, talk to as many owners /breeders as you can who have the breed, attend dog shows that you know the breed will be at, go along to Club fundays and meet owners & breeders and get there feedback or contact the breed club for recommendations.
Be aware though that some breeders will only tell you what they want you to hear but a good breeder will ask you as many questions as you ask them.
Should you want a pup from them they will probably have a puppy questionnaire they will require you to fill out, the pup will come on a contract or desexed before coming to you r depending on the breeder, plus the breeder will want to meet you first.
As a general rule great breeders breed to better what they have already they do not breed the same dogs together because they have them sitting in there yard those sort of breeders you would be best to avoid as it is a money making thing only.
MICCROCHIPPING YOUR PUP / DOG
Now that it is law that all dogs after a certain year and over the age of 3 months MUST be miccrochipped we also recommend that you do it for safety sake because if your Bordeaux should get stolen, which happens regularly, this is the only thing that will identify you as they legal owner should someone contest your ownership of the dog.
Prices for miccrochipping vary from $25 - $55 from vet to vet but usually a ring around will get you the best price but the other thing to remember is make sure you get your vet to register your Bordeaux on the main Miccrochip register, this will cost a little more but well worth it in the long run, because in the event of your dog going missing,or being stolen, which could well be when you are out of town on holiday, your dog can be easily located via any vet , spca or council authority nationwide when it is no this register ....where as if you do not ask for that then it is only on your local council register and that will also depend on whether you file it with your local council or not because if you don't then it will not be on file with them either so if your dog turns up there you risk it being put to sleep due to them not being able to locate its owner .
WHAT SHOULD I EXPECT TO PAY FOR A PUPPY & WHAT CAN I DO IF SOMETHING GOES WRONG WITH MY PUP ?
Prices can vary greatly from breeder to breeder but as a general rule of thumb you would expect to pay for a pup from health tested parents, upon seeing paperwork confirmation as in Hip / elbow score results and heart certification certificate from a cardiac specialist not just a vet, around $1500 - 2800 for a pet on limited register ...this means you get papers but can not breed from the pup and can only show them at Ribbon parades, or $1800 - 3500 for a pup on full register pup, which means you get papers and can breed from pup as well as show the pup at Championship level, but remember a breeder can charge whatever they like it solely comes down to whether you want to pay that or not.
Yes while it is possible to get puppies cheaper than this more around the $500 - 800 or so mark they are always ones to be cautious of as generally they have been breed by someone who has very little general knowledge of the breed, have not health tested either of the parents and have a male & female who have got at each other so there is a big risk the pups have not been given the quality of care they require and this could very well effect there health and bones in the years to come as good nutrition is vital to all puppies especially large/giant breed pups. You can also bet the quality of the parents is not that great to boot so save yourself in the long run and don't fall for a cheap price tag because you could be putting your pup to sleep by 12 months old if you take the risk.
Many breeders, Backyard breeders only in it for the money generally, will try and convince you that you are getting something extremely special even to the point where they will use the grandchild of Hooch off Turner & Hooch movie and that contracts are a bad thing, when in fact they are the best thing to have as it gives you piece of mind with the pup that you are buying is from a responsible breeder who is prepared to give you lifetime support with the pup which can include helping you to choose the right sire for your bitch, helping you understand basic genetics etc and mentor you in your journey to replacing your pup should a genetic illness effect the health of your pup. No responsible breeder is in it to control the pups, as some breeders will lead you to also believe they have breed they are there to help there pup owners through out the life of the pups ...good breeders stay in touch and love to hear from you you are not just a name but part of there family.
Many will also have you believe, solely generally to line there pockets, that you are buying something extremely special in the bloodlines they have ... well unless the lines on the pup you are buying from is from recently imported lines there is nothing special about it most Dogue's in New Zealand carry the same bloodlines due to only a few being bought in originally and very few new lines being brought in the country over the last 10 years until recently . Some pups that are made out to be so special can be health nightmares in the future and be a real disappointment quality wise when an adult.
Thankfully though any breeder of a litter of pups can be taken to the Disputes Tribunal for as little as $50 if you feel they have mislead you in anyway, the pup is not what you expected it to turn out like as described by the breeder and even if there is now an expensive health issue you have been left to deal with because the breeder is now not interested ...in large breeds like these that can be a very very costly mistake. Dogs come under the Sales of Goods Act so are considered goods, just like your television set, so they are expected to be in a good health and live a certain length of time ...just to clarify you can take your breeder to court up until the dog is 6 years old ....and the best way to make any breeder accountable for there lack of responsibility, especially if you suspect they are only in it for the money, is to hit them in the pocket ...its not always about the money its about teaching a lesson to an irresponsible breeder who does not care that you and your beloved pet have been left to suffer financially, physically and emotionally.
So remember NEVER rush in or fall for silly sales pitches when buying a Dogue pup in New Zealand and always do your homework ...we are always happy to help should you have some questions about a purchase you are looking at making or if you need clarification before going ahead with a pup purchase.
Bordeaux pups are the absolutely cutest pups in the world so NEVER buy on impulse it is so easy to make a poor decision because you are looking at a cute as wrinkle face but you must do your research before getting one to save yourself unnecessary heartache in the long run.
The absolute best advice I can give you is to research the breed and research the breeder and if you are not 100% happy go elsewhere .
When looking for the right breeder make sure the parents of the litter have been , at the very least , hip & elbow scored before being bred from , the breed average in January this year was 17.9 , so you want as close to that as possible or even better lower scores than thatfor both parents . Heart certification is also a bonus as there is heart issues with the breed and the outlay is a very small amount to perform these tests for peace of mind , not only for the breeder but for any puppy owners , especially now breeders can be held accountable in court should a problem arise with usually the minimum the claimant will receive is a total refund of the purchase price due to the Sale of Goods Act dogs are considered goods so therefore have to met a certain standard .
Any fear for there dogues life going under anaesthetic to have there hips & elbows x-rays is minimal to the risk they can be taking by breeder unsound parents because dysplasia is more hereditary then environmental so getting a pup from low scoring parents lessens your risk and especially if you adhere to puppy care sheet given by your breeder on pick up.
Make sure you sight all paperwork from any tests done ,both hip & elbow scoring and heart certification have appropriate paperwork to confirm these , or also to verify the dogs registration and lines , a good breeder will be more than happy to show you any paperwork . Try to meet both parents if possible to access not only there physical condition & quality but evaluate there temperament , remembering of course that some females can be a bit defensive with pups around .Due to the risk of parvo virus most breeders do not allow puppy viewing until 6 weeks of age but again after this period most breeders would be happy to oblige , but you may have to travel to see the male if a stud has been used.
Ask your chosen breeder for references of other puppy owners , does the breeder offer lifetime assistance to you should you require it ,or a guarantee , do they provide a comprehensive puppy care sheet or booklet , are they asking just as many questions of you as you are of them , do they seem to have excellent breed knowledge , are the puppies happy , healthy solid pups without wormy pot bellies , have they been reared on a good quality food and has mum also throughout the pregnancy , being large breeds this is important for the future , and finally have they been wormed every 2 weeks since whelping .
Do the pups come on a limited or full register , with 6 weeks free insurance , or have a contract to be desexed by a certain age , most responsible breeders have there pups on a contract of some form so discuss this with the breeder before committing yourself , a contract is not a bad thing it is generally a good protection for not only the owner but the breeder should things go wrong. Look at the conditions the pups are in are they clean and tidy and safe with some toys to amuse pups ! the conditions they are in are usually a good indicator as to how well the pups are cared for ….if you have any doubts at all go elsewhere .
When choosing a pup be honest with your breeder as to your lifestyle and the requirements you have for the pup whether it is going to be simply a loving pet & companion or that you wanted to do dog showing or similar and may want to breed from the pup in the future so the breeder can advice of whether any of the pups would be suitable for this purpose , no dog ever has a litter that are all of top quality there are generally 2 maybe 3 at most that are and normally the breeder would be keeping one maybe two from the litter for themselves , so you may have to add your name to a waiting list for a pup of this quality . As with any litter there are always variations in temperament between litter mates so discuss your wants & needs with your breeder , that way you won’t end up with the most outgoing demanding pup that won’t suit your situation , or the shy , less outgoing pup who finds boisterous children too much so again a good breeder will point out the one or ones that would be most suited to your situation .
Dogue pups are not placed in there new homes until at least 8 –10 weeks of age , they need there siblings and mother up until then to develop there social skills for later in life being a large breed this is very important , and also after they have had at least there first vaccination and full veterinary check . What would you expect to pay for a Dogue de Bordeaux pup , well for a pet around the $1500 -$2800 mark and for a breed quality pup on full register between $2800—$3500 depending on the parents bloodlines and what that breeder chooses to charge.
Remember to just because the breeder can show you ribbons from a local ribbon parade or similar doesn't mean they have excellent bloodlines , also bare in mind anyone can be registered with the NZKC it doesn't make them a responsible or reputable breeder, unless of course they are an Accredited breeder with the NZKC because they are required to do all health testing for there breed and are monitored .
The biggest thing with care of a Dogue de Bordeaux puppy , or any large breedpuppy for that matter , is the first 12 months when they should be fed a high quality large breed puppy food as it contains all the right levels of Calcium and nutritional requirements a large breed pup needs or a comprehensive Raw food diet suited for puppies Always have fresh water available to your pup as well . NEVER over exercise your Bordeaux pup they can usually get all the exercise they need in there daily play sessions for the first 6 months , or though some pups need to be rested because they can get a little carried away especially if there is another dog in the household to play with .Remember socialisation is a must so puppy school is a great place to start this in a safe and controlled environment until a week or so after the last vaccination then a sociable visit to a friends house , which can be done earlier if your friend also has vaccinated dogs , local park or the beach can then also be added.
NEVER allow your dogue pup to go up and down stairs ( a couple is fine ) or jump on and off beds etc , including out of the car , until they are older because this can cause major damage to growing and developing bones when they get older ,.Keep an eye on to rougher play with bigger animals than themselves … no I am not saying you have to rap them in cotton wool just caution for the first year of there life can save you in the long term , they are a large dog and those bones grow very fast so need to be taken care of . Adding some Ester C to there daily diet can be helpful for ligament and tendon development as well .
Pups should also never carry unnecessary weight, some people think the more they feed the bigger they will get , this is incorrect , a lot has to do with your dogs bloodlines firstly as to how big they get and over feeding a pup will only cause bone issues when older , there is nothing more heartbreaking than having to put your beloved pet down before 12 months of age due to dysplasia , they are better to be kept on a leaner side , especially during there fastest growth period between 5 - 8 months than to be overweight when growing .Please keep in mind most mastiff breeds are not fully grown until around the 3 year mark so they have plenty of time to get size .
NB: Thanks to Pedro diaz Valentin for the highchair puppy picture and Bev Graham for others.
WHAT YOU SHOULD KNOW BEFORE BREEDING.
So you think you might like to breed your dogue there are few things that you should be considered before doing so for not only your sake but the breeds sake here in New Zealand .
Firstly ask yourself why do you want to breed your dogue ? If it is to make some money forget it the time and cost involved in raising a litter of these pups , if done properly , is not going to make it worth it in the long run . Are you prepared to have time off work , at least three weeks , to care for the mum and pups they need to be carefully monitored as a lot of mothers can accidentally step on or lie on there pups so they do need someone around .Or then there is mum not having milk and all pups will need feeding every 2 hours 24 hours a day the whole 9 of them so sleep will become a long distant memory for a few weeks at least. Are you doing it to let the kids have the joy of witnessing the miracle of puppies being born again that could end up a total nightmare if the pups are born dead or mummified , besides most bitches give birth in the early hours and it can last for hours so are you going to get your children up at that hour when they have school the next day ! Have you been led to believe it is a good idea to let your bitch have a litter before getting her desexed ? Again a fallacy you are actually better off to get it done before to greatly lessen the risk of cancer later in her .
After all that you are still keen … alright look at your dogue is it a good representative of the breed ? If you are not sure attend a few dog shows or club events to see how your dog compares or ask the people that usually attend or organise these events can help .What are your dogs weaknesses that you want to improve on ? Do you feel your dog has a poor head then look for the appropriate mate .… Oh Kay so your dogue measures up so to do it responsibly and to avoid being taken to court the next thing to do is get all health tests done on her , and the stud , before using them for breeding to make sure they are not going to potential produce unsound puppies the first on your list is to hip and elbow scoring of both dogs to be used , this should be done between 12 and 18 months old , then evaluate the results , are they in an acceptable range comparing them to the breed average at the time , available on the NZVA website , really you want both parents lower than it and elbows no greater than 1b maximum . Next on your to do list would be heart certification to make sure neither of the parents have a heart condition that could be passed on and this is to be done by a heart specialist , not a vets stethoscope , over the age of 19 months as a lot of hereditary heart conditions do not show up until after that age. And ever breed from any Dogue that is not clear of hereditary heart conditions. These tests should cost you around the $800 mark per dog not a lot of outlay really for piece of mind .
Now by this point you should have all the answers you need as to whether this mating is going to happen or not . Most bitches are not breed from until at least 22-24 months of age so get prepared have some money in your account for a potential cesarean , around $2000 should do it if it is during the day that is double that if after hours , have a whelping box ready and the stud organised your dogs breeder may also be able to help you with this if they have good breed knowledge .
Progesterone tests will need to be done to determine the correct time for mating and a scan should be preformed by your veterinarian after around 34 days to determine if she is pregnant or not .She will need to be fed a more suitable diet before whelping so she is in the right condition for a safe delivery as pups can really deplete a poor bitch if she is not prepared in advance for the best outcome for her and pups. Remember from around 3 weeks of age mum will not clean up after pups anymore than now becomes your job and trust me there will be a fair amount of waste to deal with in the next 8 weeks .
Pups will need to be wormed every 2 weeks from birth until 3 months of age , should be fed an appropriate good quality diet for a large breed pup to make sure they receive the best possible start . They will also need there required vaccination shot and thorough vet check up from either 6 or 8 weeks of age depending on which vaccination schedule you choose .
Pups have been whelped all has gone well they have reached 8 weeks of age so now you need to find good homes for your pups , which can be hard especially in these economic times it is not cheap caring and maintaining a large breed dog so homes can be hard to find so always remember be prepared to keep a lot of the litter for a long period of time after the 8 weeks .Have you got a care package organised for the new owners instructing them on the best way to care for there new addition .
Are you going to register them with the NZKC on limited or full register ,will you have contracts to be desexed or put restrictions on there papers ! I no a lot of people think contracts are a bad thing but honestly it can be a god send should something go wrong with the pup not only for the potential new owner but for the breeder as well especially with the Sales of Goods Act available .Desexing contracts are a good thing to put into place there are far to many animals being bred from now that homes can not be found for so they are being euthanized and some very young before there life really gets going so who wants to contribute to that be a responsible breeder and take responsibility for what you bred now and in the future it is all part of being a good breeder and keeping this wonderful breed in great shape. The up to date Animal welfare Code available on the web or from MPI can help you understand what is required of you if you choose to breed .
By Bas Bosch
By Bas Bosch
After all that celebrating in the former two editions of “ the World of the Dogues de Bordeaux “ - even though there were some sobering side remarks and warnings included along with the festivities it is now time to become serious . The signs directing this change of perception are surely not new , but they have become so glaring that I would not dare to invite someone for a Dogue party right now. Yet partying is something the Dogue enthusiasts will do anyway , so let me take the serious role here by using words like responsibility—our responsibility .
The best news in that respect is the new FCI breed standard for our breed, the last and definite step taken ( within the borders of the FCI territory, the other cynological organisations that publish standards have yet to follow suit ) of a journey against hyper type that started in the Autumn of 2004 with a note for attention of judging following the SADB committee meeting . It was made clear from day one that the standard was not going to be changed , but more precision would be given at some vital parts in order to eliminate misunderstandings . In that note of 2004 five remarks were made that had to do with quality of forehead, wrinkles and teeth; the same remarks are now part of the newest standard . I have stated before how impressed I was with these very few , but vital words against hyper type , and will repeat it with all possible pleasure ( pardon me responsibility ) : “ So much more could be said about the newest development in type , but all “ those clever French “ came up with was half of an A4, catching the essentials. One has to come to this conclusion if one studies the Dogues affected by these foreign qualities.
“One example—the size of teeth—will make clear how one quality is often linked to another , culminating in a certain type. Dogues with pearls instead of proper teeth often show a ( too ) short and extra wide muzzle, thick skin hanging in folds/forming rolls, furnishing extra massive heads and affecting the shape of the eyelids ( changing the stand –off look into an expression full of melancholy ) , and extra massive bodies with hardly and tuck up and athletic ability .”
I must say that these standards “changes” have given me more relief for judging of the breed and I am quite fascinated by it all , also because of the timing . In related breeds, breeders and judges have to fight a much more sever battle against hyper type just because of the numbers of affected dogs; the result of going wrong a long time ago. Dogue de Bordeaux enthusiasts are lucky in that respect—they have every opportunity to bend , so there is no excuse to shirk responsibility now.
I do not know if the same could be said of the hereditary disorders that affect our breed, but what I do know is that the rumors have become extremely loud even to me, who does not do chat lists, forums and what have you. In the very first edition of this series I came up with the following “There is one thing which does affect my party, though, no, it is more a fear that I have , that in not to long a time we will not be able to celebrate in this way . I became aware of it when editing the first issue of “ The World of the Dogues de Bordeaux “. It concerns the champion section. Amazing to see how often a very small group of Dogues are coming back in pedigrees, spread literally all over the world. That is understandable though , as individually breeders are quite rightly going for Dogues that come closest to the standard and that have proved to be predominant breeding stock. But what will happen if a certain genetic defect pops up ? “
I was being so kind to use the phrase a certain and pops up . Any well informed Dogue enthusiast knows better of course; we have to cope with more than one serious genetic defect which have been affecting our beloved breed for quite a period of time already—some of them are almost an integral part of its history, so it is not that easy to deal with. But we cannot ignore it , and listening to the complaints that are coming in—we cannot wait much longer. This may be quite a strange way to put it , but here it is : and responsible breeder should have taken action already, but have they really ? What is the real truth behind the cliche one sees in adverts and on websites ? How many of them go for the necessary health checks and how many take action accordingly ?
When talking about hips a decent number for sure , and luckily an increasing number do elbows; but what about hearts , skin , epilepsy , et cetera ? Not nearly . Luckily the first breed clubs have taken action . They should be greatly supported as they have to deal with severe opposition—this counts for all breed clubs, of whatever breed, wherever. Do not get me wrong, I know it is far from early to deal with these matters, but there is no other way to be responsible breeder/breed Club than to take the right actions based on the right data.
Sometimes I dare to still dream; would it not be grand if especially the breeders whose Dogues dictate the show ring would also set an example for all those other breeding matters that are more important? With their strong international influence they could “ clean up “ the breed in a much shorter period of time than any “ average “ breeder or breed club alike.
To stay with my dream a bit longer and to refer to what I have written in a former preface of these Dogue de Bordeaux bi– annuals : “ I have learned a long time ago that the periods of popularity give ( the real ) good breeders the best possible opportunities to make big strides in improving the breed ; more puppies to be bred means more to select from. “ Now I would like to add : show your responsibility, at least by checking the health matters that are real issues in the breed not just one and two “ safe “ ones, but all that are serious issues. We do not need any more surveys to point out that the diseases which belong to the list . “ Dreamer, you’re nothing but a dreamer “.
Better a “hopeless “ dreamer than “going under “ in doom and gloom, and that is certainly not the way I am going to end this preface , however tempting it may be to go that direction . They are challenges: new challenges for a breed that for the first time in its long history is more popular than ever, but in principle, old challenges based on one word only … responsibility.
However difficult it is to make the right choices, in this third annual the reader will find more than enough to stay positive and find support, even if at the first glance the opposite seems to be the case. Compiling these three g=hundred pages have helped me for sure and in that respect I want to thank again all those Dogue enthusiasts, especially the correspondents who have delivered a vast amount of material that made it possible to create yet another beautiful book full of information for serious study. What is missing though, are test results … well, what is not there still can come . No problem to keep my dream alive for another two years .
Article from the 2010 World of the Dogue de Bordeaux book